My current state of being a man of leisure has given me much time to just noodle around with various ideas. One of these was an alternative timeline for Cold City that diverges away from our own (or to be accurate, more than CC already does).
From this, I've decided to post some bits and bobs here, with the obvious thought that other people should feel totally free to pitch it.
The starting point for the setting is that the Cuban Missile Crisis went terribly wrong, but instead of the nukes-a-flyin, it was the twisted technology that provided the backbone for the destructive forces. Of course, the nukes did fly to a limited extent, but these were mainly tactical weapons rather than multi-megaton city-busters.
Of course, then you have dead legions, barely controlled extra-dimensional servitor creatures and all sorts of nastiness floating around, nukes are a concern, but there are other things to worry about.
It's about a year after 'the exchange' and most of Europe is a total horror show. Well, as far as anyone can tell. The USSR had to nuke parts of itself because the stuff they were using wasn't exactly controlable, the USA got smacked by stuff sent through the Bering Sea gates (which were pretty much bigger copies of the WW2 German stuff). Some folks popped off an a-bomb or two and conditions are not entirely pleasant.
The British Isles, well, they were messing about with the twisted technology as well and didn't exactly get off scot free. All sorts of bad stuff got released from Porton Down, Spadeadam and other such locations. Windscale went toodle pip (of course Windscale was being used for twisted technology research. As well as a-bomb stuff. Nice and not at all dangerous combo) and irradiated a goodly portion of the country. And the horrors that were intended to combat a Soviet invasion rather turned on their masters. Oh, and the USSR hit the UK a bit as well.
I'm thinking that things take place in London, quasi-ruined, partially walled/barricaded, still the seat of government (remember: we didn't get hit with the same level of nukeage that was actually predicted for a Cold War strike). Bit of it are irradiated, there is ongoing strife between the military, the politicians and the scientists. Plus there's all sorts of paranoia about fifth columnists, Soviet special forces sneaking in, disease, lack of food, monsters (literally) at the gates and so on and so forth.
And what poor schmucks have to deal with all of this? Yep, the PCs. Someone has to venture into the sewers, the ruins, the Thames estuary, the old army bases, tower blocks and so forth to root out monsters, agents, spies, malingerers, hoarders and all sorts of riff raff. But mainly the monsters.
My thoughts are that instead of having National Hidden Agendas, you'll have hidden agendas related to factions within the controlling authorities. Or perhaps even some external forces. For example: you could have been seconded from the Army and be beholden to them. Or you could be a former scientist, now serving penance but still with ties of loyalty to the old group (like BERG).
Anyhow, just some thoughts and musings. More to come, doubtless, in the future.
Cheers
Malc
I'm a sucker for alternate
Submitted by Andrew Kenrick on Tue, 06/11/2007 - 09:36.
I'm a sucker for alternate histories AND post-apocalyptic shenanigans, so am all over this like a rash!
I really like the idea of it taking place in London, with each of the PCs serving a different master within the remnants of the government. Which, presumably, is something of a dictatorship now? So someone might be servicing the army, another the Home Office, another MI5 and another still a cabal of researchers seeking to regain the twisted technology for themselves! Not to mention Commie spies!
On a related note, have you seen Hellgate: London? It's also post-apocalyptic London, set after the gates of hell open in that fine city. PCs are all holed up in magically-warded underground stations, trying to harness magic to combat the demons. Something similar could work for this - civilisation/the government are operating out of twisted technology-guarded underground stations/bunkers, with the PCs venturing out to drive back the darkness, one bit at a time.
Finally, in the aftermath of a twisted technology war, would people still be trying to use twisted technology? Would it be more commonplace, or treated as anathema? What I'm getting at is, could the PCs be running around with twisted technology weaponry?
Indeed, factionalism would
Submitted by Malcolm Craig on Wed, 07/11/2007 - 03:40.
Indeed, factionalism would be running rife amongst the 'authorities'. Maybe there is also a fear of refugees from the Continent flooding into London? Boat people on the Thames? French and German ghettoes? Hmmmmm....
Not sure that i'd want to make it as post-apocalyptic as Hellgate, I was thinking more along the lines that there was still a small semblance of order in London, but with an overwhelming atmosphere or paranoia, straining control and political infighting.
TT weaponry is a tough one. I never really saw the TT as producing man-portable weaponry, I envisioned it in terms of 'big science'. Then again, people should feel totally at liberty to interpret things as they wish!
Thanks for the thoughts, keep them coming!
Cheers
Malc
Contested Ground Studios
Like Children of Men, but
Submitted by Andrew Kenrick on Wed, 07/11/2007 - 12:38.
Like Children of Men, but with more children and more monsters?
Unknown
Submitted by Malcolm Craig on Wed, 07/11/2007 - 19:45.
Like Children of Men, but with more children and more monsters?
I've not seen it, so I can't really comment.*
Cheers
Malc
*And please, don't people pile in telling me I should see it. It has been recommended numerous times by numerous people, I will get round to it eventually.
Contested Ground Studios
Ok, let me rephrase in a
Submitted by Andrew Kenrick on Thu, 08/11/2007 - 11:13.
Ok, let me rephrase in a less flippant way.
So like London, but with much more armed police, checkpoints, secure-compounds (think the Green Zone in Baghdad) and a greater chance of a radiation sun-tan.
Guantanamo-by-the-sea in Kent, with all the refugees from Europe being herded into de-facto concentration camps for "processing," and the constant risk of state-sponsored terrorists blowing themselves up everywhere.
Mix in twisted technology and monsters and you're good to go.
There, much more helpful to you. Well, maybe not.
A very cool setting
Submitted by Gregor Hutton on Thu, 08/11/2007 - 13:13.
Touches the cool vibe that I found in 28 Days Later and Day of the Triffids with its desolate urban backdrop.
Very good.
You've probably already read it all, but...
Submitted by evilgaz on Thu, 08/11/2007 - 13:27.
... Deadlands : Hell on Earth stuff is probably worth a bit of a look (as you can pick up stuff cheap as chips these days) Things like the Ghost Rock "City Buster" bombs might prove interesting in terms of low-yield nuclear weaons and such. Plus the whole "world fncked up" vibe might prove inspirational.
G
Actually, something I've
Submitted by Malcolm Craig on Fri, 09/11/2007 - 01:13.
Actually, something I've been looking at with a great deal of interest is the Resistance: Fall of Man game. They're got a pretty interest website, full of little snippets of news and information from the game world. A few hackneyed old concepts in there, but a lot of good stuff as well.
Touches the cool vibe that I found in 28 Days Later and Day of the Triffids with its desolate urban backdrop.
Very good.
Cheers Gregor! I take it you are referring to the outstanding performance of Howard 'Oklahoma!' Keel in the seminal 'Day of the Triffids' film? :-)
Or, potentially, the genuinely great 1980s TV series, which was far superior in every way. It's cool that you mention DotT, because that was kind of the vibe I was going for. Not quite the 'cosy catastrophe' vibe beloved of John Wyndham et al, but not the full on post-apocalyptic horror of 'Threads'. Despite my dislike for the film, 28 Days Later is probably pretty close to the mark.
Cheers
Malc
Cheers
Malc
Contested Ground Studios
Guantanamo-on-sea
Submitted by Malcolm Craig on Fri, 09/11/2007 - 01:18.
Ok, let me rephrase in a less flippant way.
So like London, but with much more armed police, checkpoints, secure-compounds (think the Green Zone in Baghdad) and a greater chance of a radiation sun-tan.
Guantanamo-by-the-sea in Kent, with all the refugees from Europe being herded into de-facto concentration camps for "processing," and the constant risk of state-sponsored terrorists blowing themselves up everywhere.
Mix in twisted technology and monsters and you're good to go.
There, much more helpful to you. Well, maybe not.
Hey, that is both cool and helpful. Didn't mean to come across as dismissive in the first instance, sorry.
I like the Guantanamo-on-Sea concept. Gravesend, Sheerness, all these Thames estuary places turned into de-facto concentration camps. Hmm, that's an interesting counterpoint, given that Britain strove to destroy a regime that did just such a thing only a couple of decades before. The twisted technology drives us to become what we hate.
One thing I really wanted to include (if only because of my geeky obsession with such things) were the Maunsell Army sea Forts. There are Navy Forts as well, but there were dull by comparison.
Cheers
Malc
Contested Ground Studios
Quatermass
Submitted by Nellkyn on Mon, 19/11/2007 - 14:04.
From your description I imaging it all looking like the Quatermass TV series with John Mills. The police tootling around in armoured Landies and society generally on the slide.
The idea sounds jolly good to me.
Shoot
Submitted by Per Fischer on Mon, 19/11/2007 - 17:54.
Resistance: Fall of Man game
Dieselpunk? Very good.
Interesting alternate history as well, although it kind of ends up in "shoot all those aliens from alternate history Russia" - but what can you expect from a shooter?
Per
GenCon UK used to be at a
Submitted by Gregor Hutton on Mon, 19/11/2007 - 18:41.
GenCon UK used to be at a Butlins that was once an internment camp, didn't it?
The interesting thing about the south of England is that once your main water supplies are contaminated you're kind of stuck. A dry summer is going to leave you pretty much in the grip of a severe drought. At least in the Lake District, Wales or Scotland there is a fresh supply of drinkable water.
The water table down south is pretty much screwed in the event of a breakdown of law and order. So drinking water becomes a really valuable commodity. (And you're back to the heart-breaking scenes in When The Wind Blows as they knock over their half-filled milk bottles of water...)
More Responses
Submitted by Malcolm Craig on Tue, 20/11/2007 - 02:35.
From your description I imaging it all looking like the Quatermass TV series with John Mills. The police tootling around in armoured Landies and society generally on the slide.
The idea sounds jolly good to me.
It's pretty hard for me to do stuff that isn't influenced in some way by Quatermass! Especially if it is related to Cold City. But yes, armoured Landies, Humber 'Pigs', Alvis Saracens on the sreets of London and the surrounding districts.
nteresting alternate history as well, although it kind of ends up in "shoot all those aliens from alternate history Russia" - but what can you expect from a shooter?
The history within the game promises a lot, but in the end it seems to be a shooter with knobs on. Still the website is nice and has a lot of good little touches.
The interesting thing about the south of England is that once your main water supplies are contaminated you're kind of stuck. A dry summer is going to leave you pretty much in the grip of a severe drought. At least in the Lake District, Wales or Scotland there is a fresh supply of drinkable water.
The water table down south is pretty much screwed in the event of a breakdown of law and order. So drinking water becomes a really valuable commodity. (And you're back to the heart-breaking scenes in When The Wind Blows as they knock over their half-filled milk bottles of water...)
Yep, water supply and the sewage system would go down the tubes pretty quickly in the event of a disaster. Without the pumping stations hauling the shit out of the lower level sewers, things would get nasty pretty quickly. Mind you, they could resort to firing up the old steam pumping stations at places like Crossness, which ere abandoned in the 1950's. Scavenge wood and so forth to burn in the furnaces and run the boilers. Could be interesting.
Thanks for all the further thoughts.
Cheers
Malc
Contested Ground Studios
To throw in a few more
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Mon, 17/12/2007 - 23:42.
To throw in a few more nuclear fun bits...
They make nuclear fuel just outside Preston, near Blackpool (at a site called Springfields).
Chapelcross in Dumfriesshire has the second Magnox station and a number of other facilities. And yes, it was built for a similar reason to Calder Hall at Windscale.
Capenhurst (just outside Chester on the Wirral) is where Uranium was enriched but was power fed from 3 separate conventional stations to ensure supply (you could riff on why do they need this power - twisted tech? in reality to avoid diffusion processes failures).
Of course, you have the Atomic Weapons Research Centre at Aldermaston down south (and there's another site but I can't remember what it's called at the moment) and the research labs at Harwell (UKAEA, a great site for Alternative Twisted Tech Research).
All outside London, but great sites for people to be sent to to recover things
---
Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/
Good call
Submitted by Malcolm Craig on Tue, 18/12/2007 - 03:39.
Hey Dom,
Welcome to the forums, thanks for joining up.
Glad to see that I'm thinking along the same lines, having just finished up writing one of the appendices for the game, that deals with locations outside of the Greater London area that might be of interest to groups playing Hot War.
I think Capenhurst was built after the 1960s, and therefore wouldn't exist in the Hot War timeline. All the other ones are exactly what I was thinking, though. I hadn't included Chapelcross (which my mum visited when she was a lass, working for the South of Scotland Electricity Generating Board), but have now fired it in after your comments.
Sites that I've detailed include: Burlington/SUBTERFUGE, Chapelcross, AWRE at Aldermaston (plus the sites at Foulness, Orford Ness and Burghfield), AERE at Harwell, Windscale, ROF Chorley and the ROTOR bunker network.
Cheers
Malcolm
Contested Ground Studios
Capenhurst was in operation
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Fri, 21/12/2007 - 19:16.
Capenhurst was in operation doing defence work in the 1950s.
http://www.sellafieldsites.com/page/capenhurst-site-operations/site-history
Some other bits that could make an interesting mess for the area is that just up the coast is the Shell Stanlow refinery (which I'd need to do some digging to find the opening date) and opposite, on the other side of the Mersey and not so far as the crow flies was the ICI (now Ineos) chlorine and chemicals plants. You could get a really nasty mix of chemicals etc.
All good fun. Did you catch the BBC programme on the Windscale accident and the cover-up carried out? If you didn't, I can drop it on a DVD as I recorded it.
---
Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/
The bit I forgot to mention
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Fri, 21/12/2007 - 20:01.
The bit I forgot to mention there was that the programme was worth watching just for the descriptions of the personnel involved in the bomb programme (eg Perry, Hinton etc) alone. They'd make good NPCs or people to be searching for.
---
Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/
Some more locations of a
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Fri, 21/12/2007 - 20:39.
Some more locations of a slightly different type that may draw people outside London for information.
1) Winsford Rock Salt Mine.
The only working rock salt mine in the UK, it was (and is) used for secure storage of archives etc in WW2 and subsequent periods. It would be a good location to deep archive twisted technology that you wanted to keep but not have around.
http://www.saltunion.com/winsfordrocksaltmine/
2) National Lending Library for Science and Technology
Set up in Boston Spa in 1961, by Wetherby on the A1 between York and Leeds, and to the north edge of a Royal Ordnance Factory closed in 1958 (ROF Thorp Arch). There's also a prison on the site, but I couldn't establish whether it was open at the same time. The facility is focused on science and technology info and holds different material to the main British Library. It may, again, be a good site to send people to with the aim of retrieving information.
http://www.bl.uk/aboutus/quickinfo/facts/history/index.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ROF_Thorp_Arch
I'll see if I can think of any more fun things to share.
---
Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/
War of the Worlds
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Mon, 24/12/2007 - 10:31.
Saw the Jeff Wayne version of this at Sheffield the other week, and it may be worth having a listen to it. It certainly has a nice post apocalyptic vibe, although maybe too apocalyptic for Hot War? If you have it on disc, it's the second side that's worth more of a listen.
The Tom Cruise movie is worth a look, as it does deal with the effects of collapsing civilisation quite well and the imagery is more up to date than that in the stage version. Admittedly, Children of Man is probably better, as mentioned earlier.
A more left field resource would be 'Hard Times', for MegaTraveller. This deals with the impacts of post war society as trade etc fails. May be a bit too SF though. Twilight 2000 is the other classic to look at (and the CD ROM version is the best way to get that), but – again – it may be too apocalyptic.
---
Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/
Cheers!
Submitted by Malcolm Craig on Fri, 28/12/2007 - 01:25.
Thanks for the further info and for the correction about the dates of operation for Capenhurst.
One of my main sources for information online about bunkers and underground strangeness is the fantastic Subterranea Britannica, a vast and extremely well researched resource.
Twilight: 2000 is already listed in my influences, as it was the 2nd RPG I played as a young lad and it would be remiss not to give it credit. Writing HW has reminded me of a short T:2000 campaign we played many years ago, set in and around Oxfordshire.
Cheers
Malc
Contested Ground Studios
Other sites
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Sat, 29/12/2007 - 18:55.
Capenhurst would have been running a diffusion process at that time, which was massively energy intensive compared to the gas centrifuges used later on. It's why they went for three power stations near by to give security of supply. Any loss of power would dump all the enrichment product that they were working on.
I like the Subterranea site. Other useful sites for raiding include (stuff I was looking at for Delta Green):
http://www.canalmuseum.org.uk/history/index.html
http://underground-history.co.uk/front.php
http://www.derelictlondon.com/derelict_london_com.htm
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/alan-turnbull/secret.htm#maps
I've been kicking around some other stuff which I may drop you on an email when I get back home to my main machine with your address on it.
Dom
---
Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/
Oh, PS3
Submitted by Gregor Hutton on Sun, 30/12/2007 - 11:39.
We were playing Resistance: Fall of Man on the PS3 and wall-mounted HD TV last night. It is really visually spectacular and the attention to 50s detail was remarkable. Anyway, we laid waste to a bunch of freakish things in York and Manchester before heading home.
:-D
You should have said. You
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Mon, 31/12/2007 - 20:47.
You should have said. You could have stopped on the way from York for a beer ;-)
---
Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/
Orford Ness
Submitted by Nellkyn on Mon, 14/01/2008 - 10:38.
Can I just add Orford Ness to Dom's ever expanding list of sites. The whole peninsula was administrated by the MoD throughout the Cold War. The AWRE had a base on the site.
http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/uk/orford_ness.htm
http://www.subbrit.org.uk/rsg/sites/o/orfordness/
I think the 'pagodas' are such a fine visual image to add to any game set in 'modern' UK.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Orfordness_pagodas.spliced.jpg
There is also Cobra Mist station. An experimental over-the–horizon radar station. This may have been built after the time of HW.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cobra_Mist
PS
I've recently seen Children of Men and felt is matched Malc's original thoughts on the game surprisingly closely.
Book of the Website
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Mon, 14/01/2008 - 21:00.
http://www.derelictlondon.com/derelict_london_com.htm
There is a forthcoming book of this listed on Amazon.co.uk:
# Derelict London (Paperback)
# by Paul Talling (Author)
# Paperback: 224 pages
# Publisher: Random House Books (24 April 2008)
# Language English
# ISBN-10: 1905211430
# ISBN-13: 978-1905211432
It's £6.59 according to the list.
---
Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/
More sites
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Mon, 14/01/2008 - 21:07.
More sites of interest around London:
Woolwich Royal Arsenal
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Arsenal
Enfield - Royal Small Arms Factory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Small_Arms_Factory
The Explosives Research and Development Establishment
(24km north of London)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waltham_Abbey_Royal_Gunpowder_Mills
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Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/
Thames Sites and others
Submitted by Dom Mooney on Mon, 14/01/2008 - 21:36.
Shell Haven
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shell_Haven#Thames_Haven
Canvey Island Monster
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canvey_Island_Monster
Outer London Defence Ring
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outer_London_Defence_Ring
Hardened Field Defences (probably to much detail but nice flavour)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_hardened_field_defences_of_World_War_II
GHQ Line (crosses Canvey Island)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GHQ_Line
Citadels under London
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_citadels_under_London
Kingsway Telephone Exchange
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingsway_telephone_exchange
Civil Defence Centres in London
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_defence_centres_in_London
Closed Underground Stations summary
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closed_London_Underground_stations
Scary Pages with underground line layouts!!
http://www.davros.org/rail/culg/
Bradwell Nuclear Power Station (Magnox), commissioned 1962
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bradwell_Power_Station
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Dom Mooney
http://www.bits.org.uk/
http://www.powerprojection.net/