You need to talk about it more Iain. I haven't heard much about it online since it's release (or before, tbh). Some blog posts or posts on the Forge/Story Games would be useful.

I know from talking to you that it had rather an interesting development cycle, undergoing major changes after Gencon (last year?) - I'd be interested in reading more about that. What did you change and why? What were your original aims with the game and how did they change along the way? Are you pleased with the game, and have they met your needs?

Also, it's been out for a year as an Ashcan - how has that experience been? Has it been helpful? What has changed between versions?

And finally - you must have played it and playtested it? Where are the actual play reports?

Good reviews are helpful, but will not by themselves shift your game. I discovered this with Dead of Night. Year one of sales we had incredible reviews from all manner of high profile reviewers, but this didn't translate into sales. But I didn't talk about it or talk about my games. When I started doing this, so did other people (namely Ron), and the ball got rolling a bit more.

Yeah, AP doesn't have to be from an immediately close game, it can be reflecting back on actual play experience from any time.

For instance, I would be interested in reading about you comparing AP from a while ago and its problems as you see them, with examples of more recent AP and how you believe the game now solves those problems and supports play.

I think the key is show don't tell.

So, can you think of things you have specifically fixed in the last year on the game or so, with examples of how they were unsatisfying before but are now improved?

I also feel you can't rely on Luke or Jared to promote your game. The most important person to do that is you.

Getting reviews from CW and Paul Tevis will help, but online discussion and showing your game's mechanics in play is better.

It's hard, I know. There is a fine line between having a positive online presence (like, say, Fred Hicks and Rob Donoghue for SOTC) and being the a-hole that goes on about Mob Justice all the time.

But, ask yourself this. You have a lot of awareness of, and threads about, Stitch and Reel Adventures on the Forge, Story Games and here. Compare that with Mob Justice. Which game is available to buy right now?

I think we all need to learn the lessons that Andy talks about.

Advice noted. I have some trouble some times with self promotion, finding myself thinking that I have crossed the line that Gregor mentions. I think I will certainly be back doing forge stuff soon as I have neglected that site for a little for reasons I am not quite sure of.

Andy's suggestion of saying 'So Mj is out here, here is my experience here is what changed etc.' is fantastic and is certainly something I will look to do over this weekend while gencon is still fresh in people's minds. I will also drag up some old APs and see about posting them.

The trouble with APs is that whilst I was doing MJ I wasn't really aware of that culture enough to latch onto it and record stuff a bit more accurately. I am sure I can come up with something though.

Your help, as always friends, is appreciated.

Cheers

Iain

Mob Justice now available!

'The Giant Brain':Small games, big ideas.

This was a big issue I had with noting things down for AP. The point being AP does not equal transcription.

Sure, for some playtests it's useful to see what was done in a particular order, etc. but often AP is simple as what you did in game from recollection.

Then people can reflect on it and poke questions about why those choices were made, or how those things came about. What jarred in the system and what was driven by it?

The big buttons when I was pitching MJ at GenCon were the clash between Loyalties and Codes. People liked that, can you show that in play? The other was bluffing the GM, or the GM bluffing the players, in a conflict. That lit up eyes.

So, it probably doesn't have to be about so-and-so hitting a flush or whatever. But what stories were you telling and how did the system help support or shape them?

I presume the system now does a better job of that right? I hope this helps.

First, bummer about the disappointing sales. Cheer up! They'll get moving.

Secondly, self-promotion is very very challenging. It is a cross between effective sales (this is what I've got that you'll like) and being humble (its cool, and I'm not arrogant). In my experience, this is all about practice as Gregor points out. The more you do it, the better you get.

It seems Andrew and Gregor are on to something here - you have a very strong presence for a number of games that are in development. Why not jump start that with MJ? Might I suggestion - dig out those APs as the starts for a message board then rope some locals (even though they are tired of playing it) into the board. Even if it is has been a while since they played, MJ leaves an impression on players and previous playtesters with some time might be willing to comment. Don't feel you've got to do all the work - send out a call and make the first post; folks will follow your energy. The more people (by that I mean other players) talk about it, the more others will be curious enough to get involved. Its just that simple.

Most importantly, you are selling a product just as much as yourself so let your excitement and enthusiasum show. The only way to do this is to press hands with it and make some noise. Use every connection you have to get it out the door - if it means sending copies to well known connections to get it talked about, bit the bullet and send a few (not more than a handful). Also, the type of noise you are making on these forums is perfect... work in progress so translate that to MJ.

Good luck and keep up the fantastic work!

GG

Thanks you very much gaming gnome do you have a real name that we may call you by?

I am going to work up some MJ posts over this weekend, I have a few days off because of the bank holiday, and hopefully some AP with gregor and joe next week.

Cheers

Iain

Mob Justice now available!

'The Giant Brain':Small games, big ideas.

Happy to kick ideas about on the publicity front... I'm pretty good with the cold sales of unique products.

GG

Iain,

One thing that Mob Justice is lacking: awareness.

Now, prior to leaving on my travels (and during, to a limited extent), I did the usual round of press releases to RPGnet, Gaming Report, etc, all the usual suspects. However, this has to be backed with buzz from others sources. PR is just window dressing, the real awareness comes from, as others have said, AP, questions about the game, mentions on blogs and podcasts, etc.

One thing I noticed at GC when pitching the game to people was a lack of familiarity and maybe, a turn off from the subject matter. The first one is resolveable through awareness, as is the second one. But it's the second one that really needs work. I call this the 'Contenders Effect'.

Boxing? Why the hell should I be interested in boxing? Boxing sucks. Contenders is a nice set of mechanics, but I don't want to play a game about boxing. Then I play the game and see it is a fantastic tool for creating amazing stories about ordinary people in difficult situations. it's a wonderful game that I cannot give enough good press to. I disliked the idea but am now a hugely keen supporter of the game. This is what MJ needs. MJ is a game about stories of honour, loyalty, betrayal, friendship, crime, bravery and cowardice (I said as much to the many people who browsed the book). Online chat and AP needs to back this up and show that it is the core of the game experience.

I hope this helps.

Cheers
Malcolm

Contested Ground Studios

We're playing this on Thursday so we should get the ball rolling then.