Readers / Playtesters, anyone?

Destriarch's picture

I'm currently putting the finishing touches to one of my mini-RPGs that I'm hoping to have out by the end of the year if all goes well. There's still a fair bit of work to do on it though, and I especially want to bulk out the GM's section and answer any questions or address any confusing points that might arise from the text. So I'm looking around to see if anyone is willing to help me by checking over the text I have so far and asking questions / making suggestions for stuff that could be usefully included.

The game's core concept is schoolkids making their way through an old-fashioned boarding school, getting into scrapes, foiling bank robbers, avoiding the bullies and annoying the teachers, all while trying to learn enough to pass their end-of-year exams and win the big trophy for their house. It's inspired primarily by shows like Grange Hill, Biker Grove, the St Trinians movies and the Famous Five books, with maybe a little bit of Harry Potter thrown in for good measure.

I don't want to put an open link on the Internet if I can avoid it, so at this stage I'm just asking for volunteers that I can email playtest copies to. You don't need to actually play it if you don't want to (although a playtest would be useful) a cursory read-through and comment would be fine.

Ash

I'd love too, though I've

David Donachie's picture

I'd love too, though I've knackered my wrist and can't type so well right now.

http://www.solipsist-rpg.com/ - http://cubicle-7.com/starblazer/

Goddamit!

Neil Gow's picture

When I was a nipper I wrote a game called 'Skool Dayz' which was exactly that premise! It was ridiculously complicated (included ink pellet splat radius) and was more than a little bit satirical about the teachers at my school! I was just thinking about it at the weekend and voila, this appears. Serendipity!

Neil

Take the King's shilling at http://www.omnihedron.co.uk/dutyandhonour/

Ah Memories!

Destriarch's picture
Neil Gow wrote:

When I was a nipper I wrote a game called 'Skool Dayz' which was exactly that premise!

Any relation to / inspiration from the computer game of the same name, and its sequel "Back to Skool"? I used to love those games on the dear ol' ZX Spectrum.

Seriously though, I see the main draw of the game being misty-eyed nostalgia, so this kind of response is very encouraging! I'm drafting up a playtest document today, should be able to mail something out for checking by this evening if all goes well. Art is also looking promising; I'm hoping that the PDF version at least will be full colour.

Ash

So...

Matt's picture
Ash wrote:

I don't want to put an open link on the Internet if I can avoid it, so at this stage I'm just asking for volunteers that I can email playtest copies to. You don't need to actually play it if you don't want to (although a playtest would be useful) a cursory read-through and comment would be fine.

So here's a thing. You'll get less response saying "email me" than you would if you just put it up. The extra hoop you make people jump through takes them from "yeah I'll take a quick look", where your good writing can hook them, to "I can't be arsed" where you get nada. It also sends a message of mistrust to the community at large, which again won't do you any favours from the marketing angle.

If you want to do things by email, I'd suggest picking people you think will be pre-disposed and contacting them directly with a personal email.

-Matt

Realms Publishing

Back to School

Gregor Hutton's picture

I loved that game. I'm happy to look it over, though I'm quite busy at the moment.

If you're just wanting a read through and comments then I could do that.

-Gregor

Trust

Destriarch's picture
Matt wrote:

So here's a thing. You'll get less response saying "email me" than you would if you just put it up. The extra hoop you make people jump through takes them from "yeah I'll take a quick look", where your good writing can hook them, to "I can't be arsed" where you get nada. It also sends a message of mistrust to the community at large, which again won't do you any favours from the marketing angle.

I'd be happier about providing direct downloads if there were some way of restricting downloads to people who are signed in as members. If anyone could download it then it's more than just the community who has access to it, albeit that visitors from outside the community are less likely.

Ash

Sure thing

Shane Boone's picture

I would be happy to take a look at it and provide feedback (got some free time this week coming up)

Shane

Google Docs

Graham W's picture

Ash, you could host it on Google Documents and publish it as a webpage. Then you can take the copy down any time.

Graham

Proof Document

Destriarch's picture

Ok, it seemed easier to just put it on my own website in an unadvertised folder. Here's a link. You'll probably want to right-click and save as, although it's a pretty small PDF so you may not need to.

http://sanestudios.peregrinedruids.com/temp/CD_Beta.pdf

Ash

Any chance of the password

David Donachie's picture

Any chance of the password so I can annotate it and send back an annotated version?

http://www.solipsist-rpg.com/ - http://cubicle-7.com/starblazer/

Annotation

Destriarch's picture

I've never used the annotation options in PDF, so I always forget it's there. Um. Actually I forgot I'd passworded it at all, or why I did it. I'm really not with it at the moment. I'll post a fresh version sans-password in a second.

Ash

Readthrough

Destriarch's picture
Gregor Hutton wrote:

If you're just wanting a read through and comments then I could do that.

Oops missed this one. Yeah, a readthrough is fine. Mostly I just want to know if there's anything I might have missed, especially in the GM advice chapter which I reckon definately needs more stuff.

Ash

Okay, I've sent back an

David Donachie's picture

Okay, I've sent back an annotated version.

Do you want general comments here too?

http://www.solipsist-rpg.com/ - http://cubicle-7.com/starblazer/

Comments

Destriarch's picture

Wherever you like, it's all useful.

Thoughts

Matt's picture

I like the tone. It's got that inter-war years timelessness going on in the boarding school / houses / teachers and so on. Occasionally it breaks from this, and I think it loses something at those points.

Generally, I think you need to pay close attention to the places in the text where you get handwavy about how we play the game and exactly what people should be doing to get the best results. That's a bugbear of mine in general though.

The Timetable section seems to mix game-time and real time, and left me feeling that you'd tried to model it too much on a real school term and not enough on how you want play to pan out. With 4 scenes a day and 14 weeks in a term, that seems like either a big play footprint or something missing from the description.

I think if you compressed this down into a nice structure of typical events (like Shab Al Hiri Roach does), it'd provide a great backdrop structure to play around. Maybe go through a load of genre books/TV and identify the ratio of in class, out of class, and events segments to give it that feel and make sure each scene adds something.

The other thing that I think is missing is situation generation. We've got characters (kids) and setting (the school), but what helps us get the most out of those two. Why these kids in this setting? What tools can you give the group to really kick it up a notch? The goals stuff is almost there, but feels really vague, maybe there's a way to rephrase and distill it. Maybe it needs example goals, or particular ways of phrasing them, so that the Headmaster can get the most from them and flag up ideal antagonism?

-Matt

Realms Publishing

Some additional thoughts

Shane Boone's picture

I think you've captured the entire school experience quite well. Good job!

Solid mechanics; I especially like "Going for the Double". This is a very nice way of giving the players the option of "pushing" and should provide for some very tense moments.

I think more examples involving game mechanics and situations (i.e. fighting) would make it easier to get a firm understanding of the mechanics.

Also, it might be beneficial to provide some sort of rules summary; if I could glance down at a summary sheet and see that "legging it" was an option, it might be one of those "oh, I forgot about that ... that's perfect" kind of moments.

Anyway, just some suggestions. Very nice!

- Shane -

I totally agree with the

David Donachie's picture

I totally agree with the others that the writing is lovely, and there is a really nice tone to the game, it made me smile and laugh in places, its very well done.

The rules too seem solid, though the ordering of them threw me a bit, there was a lot of introducing the mechanics before the setting, which my personal preferences don't like. I'd put the setting first, then follow with chargen and rules. Your ruleset is very stat based, so it makes sense to do that.

Others have already hilighted the time management bit, but I think you've already revised the lesson use, which should streamline things a lot.

But yes, there is still a question of story. It seems pretty GM led to me, in terms of the longer term plots, but I think you need much more about that. What sort of plots are you expecting? How should the GM create antagonists? How much should the antagonism come from pupils, teachers, outsiders? How does he create and budget antagonists? How should he weave story and timetable? Are classes background or obstacles? And so on.

As an aside ... you've sort of handwaved away final term exams .. that seems wrong to me.

http://www.solipsist-rpg.com/ - http://cubicle-7.com/starblazer/

Matt:

Destriarch's picture
Matt wrote:

Maybe it needs example goals, or particular ways of phrasing them, so that the Headmaster can get the most from them and flag up ideal antagonism?

Yeah, the whole thing is missing examples at the moment. Those *will* be put in when the rules are finalised, so don't worry too much about that.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by a 'big play footprint', could you be a bit more explicit about what you don't like about the timetable structure? Similarly, what do you mean by 'situation generation'? I'm very much against the idea of making games that only fit one specific scenario. I think it's important to allow players and GMs room to manoeuvre and make their own stories. Or do you mean something more along the lines of GM advice as to how to construct a good plotline that works in the setting? That's basically what I'm looking for suggestions about.

Ash

Shane

Destriarch's picture
Shane Boone wrote:

Also, it might be beneficial to provide some sort of rules summary; if I could glance down at a summary sheet and see that "legging it" was an option, it might be one of those "oh, I forgot about that ... that's perfect" kind of moments.

Good idea, I'll slip one in somewhere. I usually have bullet point summaries at the end of important sections but I think all on one sheet would work better in this instance.

Ash

David:

Destriarch's picture
David Donachie wrote:

But yes, there is still a question of story. It seems pretty GM led to me, in terms of the longer term plots, but I think you need much more about that. What sort of plots are you expecting? How should the GM create antagonists? How much should the antagonism come from pupils, teachers, outsiders? How does he create and budget antagonists? How should he weave story and timetable? Are classes background or obstacles? And so on.

Great, this is the sort of stuff I can never think of. Not *how* to do it, but *what* needs writing about in the first place, if you get my meaning. I'll get around sorting this out.

Also looks like the book could use reordering. Fortunately that's easy enough as it's all in separate chapters at the moment.

Thanks for the advice everyone, I'll work through some additional tweaks and changes over the rest of the week and hopefully I'll have a semi-ready manuscript soon.

Ash

So...

Matt's picture
Ash wrote:

I think it's important to allow players and GMs room to manoeuvre and make their own stories.

I'm not suggesting removing that, I'm suggesting actually giving them the tools to make those stories and focus in on what they find cool, rather than handwaving how that happens. Basically I'm sure there's a process in your head, that isn't on the page, about how when given pupils A, B and C, the GM uses elements from what they provide to create the best possible stuff to happen in game.

What I'm talking about is tools/rules/structure to focus the players in on how to get the most out of these characters right here. What potential story stuff do the players need to provide, and the GM need to build on, to get the best possible play in the style you're looking for?

So, as David says, you need more info on how the GM forms events to throw at the players. But that stuff starts by him looking at what the PCs provide. What questions should he be asking? What data does he need? Can you streamline character creation so it provides that data upfront and makes his job easy? This is stuff that'll be really valuable in play.

-Matt

Realms Publishing

Ah right

Destriarch's picture

Cool, that makes more sense. Like I said, the GM section definately needs beefing up. Not sure what I can do about character generation, but I have been feeling that there is something missing from it. I'll take another look through it.

Ash

Well, to give inspiration

Matt's picture

What do you envision a typical character doing? What kinds of conflicts will they be involved in? Start with that and work back with requirements needed to hit those points. This is where that long hard look at the inspirational material comes in handy.

So, for example, typical plot point in school dramas: A character might be under threat of expulsion. Ok, cool. What does the Gm need to create the best story for him? Well, something he needs to do that puts him at risk of getting closer to expulsion. So, abstracting up a level to be useful for all situations, maybe characters need two conflicting goals, rather than one? Maybe there's a "school wants" vs "I want" vs "parents want", thing you could put on the sheet and harness?

-Matt

Realms Publishing

I think the key is, if you

David Donachie's picture

I think the key is, if you sit down and start to run this as a GM, where do you start with your plot ideas? How do you prepare something that will hit the character's interests, what key equivalents do they have?

I mean, I think in terms of Jennings, and Harry Potter, and the Famous Five, so I'm thinking of making up a bully (do I generate NPCs ahead of time), and a plot involving a Russian spy ... or a school trip that goes wrong, but I need help with that.

I need you to tell me what sort of stories I should have, and *how* I should pick story types based on what I see the players creating, and *how* I turn that into a game (e.g. how much preparation should I be doing, how much plot should I prepare?) Am I drawing maps and timelines, am I making Bangs, am I throwing out a few lightly held tidbits and then seeing who bites what? All of these things are possible techniques but your text doesn't yet tell me which ones suit these rules, and setting.

http://www.solipsist-rpg.com/ - http://cubicle-7.com/starblazer/